View Full Version : Damn allies, leave me alone! A.K.A Need Help
I'm the biggest kingdom (Khazar turned into the Golden Horde...God knows why) on the map with 20 provinces, and had made peace with all my enemies except little (Turning big again) Bulgaria and far away Sicily.
I'll probably make peace with both next time I play, so you could say peace has finally come to my kingdom....or did it? -.-
The people grew tired of my wars and are rebelling like crazy (Which is exactly why I've stopped the wars), so all my armies (4) are on rebel patrol. I figured I'd use this time to build up my economy, get a Kingdom Advantage or two, and restore my Kingdom Power to 0 (Currently on -5. Read on to know why).
Problem is, my allies (And there are a lot of them...long story) have other plans, which basically involve ripping each other throats out.
Now, with most of my cities on 20+ revolt chance solely because of wars, I can't really get involved in their bickerings; Which means I have to decline every request for help, which means I can't get my Kingdom Power up, which really hurts my economy, not to mention destroy my relationships with everybody (And that probably means I'll end up getting war declarations from every country on the map).
So How do I stop them from asking me for help every 30 seconds?
P.S: I've thought about getting into war again, but I really can't fight the rebels and other kingdoms at the same time. I've tried fighting against the unhappiness with Inns and such (The King and Queen bore like 5 children in the past hour, and the people simply don't give a damn), but it doesn't real help too much.
you have to stay in total peace for at least one second and the war exhaustion will be removed. The longer you stay in peace, the better - it automatically removes nostalgy (as pagan nation you are not able to have clerics and remove nostalgy via adoptions)
at the same time try to increase you rkingdom power as soon as possible, at least out from negative values.
and my advice for your next game: don't sign alliances with everyone. be carefull in chosing your allies (if you just want to use them, NA pact is enough for you) and try to avoid their wars against each other (asking them to join wars against common enemy)
It's a vicious circle, you got yourself into. Y'see, usually allies ask for help when your relations with them are high, in green spectre. When you attack an enemy, your relations with its enemies (including those of your allies who at war with the one you attack) rapidly increase. When you capture an enemy town, those relations increase drastically. Naturally, when ou make peace with the enemy, your relations with your allies are so high, they ask you to attack again almost immediately. One of the ways to reduce this effect is not to attack the enemy after declaring war. But still, being at war won't let you to get rid off the war exhaustion, as Elvain already explained.
And the enemy won't be willing to make peace if won't defeat him a couple of times. So, you'll have to wait if the enemy will come to you by himself and let you defeat him on your own territory. Good thing is, there's a higher chance to capture the enemy marshal on your own territory. By releasing him you can both make the enemy to sign peace and worsen your relations with your own allies a bit. :)
Thanks for the advice and information, both of you. It's good to know the war exhaustion will disappear quickly after I'm in total peace. If that is really the case, I won't have any problem warring a new kingdom.
So, for now, I'll simply won't try to deal with my Kingdom Power until I have total peace. In the mean time, my relationship with nearby kingdoms will drop, so that's also good. After that, I'll be able to attack new kingdoms (And after that, which will require me to break some alliances, I'll start investing money in Kingdom Power).
Just in case it interests you, this is how I got myself into so many alliances:
It began with my need to capture the near Byzantium province (The one they start with on the northern shore of the Black Sea) as part of my plan to eventually get some Kingdom Advantages (Since I only started with one province with access to the sea, I believe).
So, to protect myself, I allied with Armenia (So I could invoke the alliance in case I needed their help), and attacked.
The attack seemed to please Germany, Italy and the Papacy, with which I signed a NA immediately.
I thought I could make peace with Byzantium right away, since they had no provinces near me anymore, so there would be no point in fighting. The Emperor got into a frenzy, however, declined my offer of peace, and used his connections to bring Bulgaria, Hungary, Zeta and Sicily into a war with me.
Immediately I offered an alliance to the three kingdoms I had good relationship with in the west, and invoked them, along with Armenia, to fight my enemies.
Into this world war joined the Russian nations (Moscvoy, Kazar and all those dudes), one unable to attack me because of the NA contract I had with it prior to the war. they were, however, also at war with each other and Byzantium's friends.
So, all hell broke loss, and long story short, Italy and the Papacy are no longer amongst us, Germany is not as big as it used to be (Probably because of their own problems with the other countries in the area), I personally destroyed two Russian nations, another passed away, Novgord got into the fight , I allied with Muscvoy, etc' etc'.
That is why, after I stopped the wars, I have a lot of nations who like me (More like scared of me, but still), and everybody wants a piece of somebody because the unifying Byzantium is almost dead, or they warred each other ever since the beginning (Like Bulgaria and Armenia).
Anyways, thanks again XD
I thought I could make peace with Byzantium right away, since they had no provinces near me anymore, so there would be no point in fighting. The Emperor got into a frenzy, however, declined my offer of peace, and used his connections to bring Bulgaria, Hungary, Zeta and Sicily into a war with me.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I tend to believe some of the coastal provinces count as naighbours of provinces on the other side of the sea/strait. So Crimea may be a neighbour of Sinop or Trebizond. Then again, big countries like Byzantium (in this period) tend to look down at smaller ones.
And playing as a Pagan nation is always diplomatically hard - when I started my Golden Horde game, I couldn't get anyone to sign peace with me until I conquered half of Asia Minor. I guess people don't like to negotiate with the heathens... ;)
Like we need those puppets. I have them all around my little finger, and will soon have them in my dungeons.
Dungeons, I say!
Oh, and I've noticed my religion takes 30% of my income O.o
Any way to decrease that, besides converting (Because I like being Pagan and not having to convert provinces)?
Oh, and I've noticed my religion takes 30% of my income O.o
Any way to decrease that, besides converting (Because I like being Pagan and not having to convert provinces)?
No, you have to live with it.
I'm the biggest kingdom (Khazar turned into the Golden Horde...God knows why) on the map with 20 provinces, and had made peace with all my enemies except little (Turning big again) Bulgaria and far away Sicily.
I'll probably make peace with both next time I play, so you could say peace has finally come to my kingdom....or did it? -.-
The people grew tired of my wars and are rebelling like crazy (Which is exactly why I've stopped the wars), so all my armies (4) are on rebel patrol. I figured I'd use this time to build up my economy, get a Kingdom Advantage or two, and restore my Kingdom Power to 0 (Currently on -5. Read on to know why).
Problem is, my allies (And there are a lot of them...long story) have other plans, which basically involve ripping each other throats out.
Now, with most of my cities on 20+ revolt chance solely because of wars, I can't really get involved in their bickerings; Which means I have to decline every request for help, which means I can't get my Kingdom Power up, which really hurts my economy, not to mention destroy my relationships with everybody (And that probably means I'll end up getting war declarations from every country on the map).
So How do I stop them from asking me for help every 30 seconds?
P.S: I've thought about getting into war again, but I really can't fight the rebels and other kingdoms at the same time. I've tried fighting against the unhappiness with Inns and such (The King and Queen bore like 5 children in the past hour, and the people simply don't give a damn), but it doesn't real help too much.
alliances in koh just suck, so just don't make them
war help from allies isn't really there, it is better to use towns for production of gold, and they will all betray you at the end (always!!!!)
and they will all betray you at the end (always!!!!)
not if you betray them first :D I always do that when I play Total Conquest :cool:
alliances in koh just suck, so just don't make them
war help from allies isn't really there, it is better to use towns for production of gold, and they will all betray you at the end (always!!!!)
Well, it does give you a reason to take land, usually at some point during your relatively peaceful reign, somebody else winds up starting a civil war that creates a good deal of rouge kingdoms, just declare war on them and you will eventually take over most of your allies' states.
Mathyas Rex
8 Sep 2008, 18:01
Good tip: if you want to end an alliance with a kingdom, without breaking the pact and thus weakening the kingdom power, declare war on a kingdom they have an alliance/NA with and good relations, invoke alliance and chanses are your ally will dishonour the pact.
BishopaZ
17 Sep 2008, 16:34
by the way where can I see what alliances my opponents have ?
When you click on their kingdom and the resource bar is shown. You can click on the shield at either side and it shows the king of that province. Also shown is a moneybag symbol, a spy symbol and flags symbol. The flag symbol when clicked shows their relations or political information.
ecthelion
30 Sep 2008, 10:36
Alliances, in general, are not a good thing to have in KoH - I typically go up to non-aggression pact, and only when I'm overwhelmingly powerful (and therefore have little to worry about) do I enter maybe one or two (at most) alliances. Other than alliance invocations (which you can't ignore), I typically ignore other demands (even crusade ones; I just pay the Papacy some money or donate to the Church to improve my relations with all Catholic kingdoms), which is made easier by right-clicking on them when they appear.
And if you're at war with a nation, so long as the king isn't arrogant and your actual relations (despite being at war) are uneasy or better, there's a good chance that you can get peace and demand vassalage of the other kingdom (so long as that kingdom isn't already someone else's vassal and you're at least moderately powerful, i.e. not a one-territory kingdom). Eventually, you can send a spy into that kingdom, and when you're large enough you can annex the entire vassal into your territory (you'd better have clerics on hand, though, to adopt populations and convert them, if necessary; otherwise you're going to have a lot of rebellions and you might possibly lose a few of those new provinces).
ecthelion
30 Sep 2008, 10:39
And don't forget - a royal marriage is tantamount to an alliance (kingdoms will invoke the marriage, even if you're not allied, though I don't think refusal under such circumstances will have as drastic an effect as dropping your kingdom power from 5 to 0), so I make a habit of entering into alliances only with kingdoms whose royal children are married to mine.
A lot of times, if you marry a princess to another kingdom, when your king dies, that kingdom will demand land. If you were on good terms before the king's death, you should refuse the demand (which will put you at war with that kingdom), then usually demanding vassalage as peace terms will get you peace and a new vassal. Sometimes, though, you will have to kick that kingdom's ass, but hey, a little war never hurt anyone, now did it? :P
We need to make FAQ, for all the newcomers. :D
We need to make FAQ, for all the newcomers. :DWhat a coincidence, I thought that as well, some time ago.. (not related to thread).
So, someone?
Perhaps making a fansite again, hmm...
Now can I?
meketreff
29 Jan 2009, 07:48
I play the game just very recently but played frequently. This is what I incorporated from Alliances:
It can be a commom missundertoding to have many Ally. Be an Ally is what it means, you are an Ally to help always at war (Ally is linked to war support, not friendship even tough it comes along. You can be friends disregard of that). Be at good terms and peace is a separated thing. Before trying to be an Ally with any nation, one should look into it's diplomacy with others, to see in what you might take into. Having up to 2 Allies seems enough to me.
But Alliances do help, but not like someone would expect. When you want an Ally, you should look for one that is close to your main enemy and usually a strong, not quite the one you want to conquer. Then by going in "Invoke Alliance", you ask your ally to begin war to that nation, a request they might undertake.
There is no option to send armies altogether etc. in the game, but they send armies eventually and that keep the nation you were at war with, buzzy and they will trow attacks at you less often (sometimes much less or stop) since they are engaging other problems too. So it can be nice to make an Alliance. They might ask you to engage someone but, tough in war, you don't have to atack. Most times they are so buzzy with other nations, or your Ally will ask you to engage war with one that is far away so that it will not bother, but if you make Alliance with someone not in war at and in good geographic position to the enemy, it might prove very worthy to your intents depending on them.
Exemple: When I'm angry with some nation even far away, I try Alliance with another one close to it, not currently in war with them to create them problems. It is good especially for nations that are growing fast. You are better not letting anyone get big, while you go making your way to be big. If in the exemple, I would let that smaller nation there, close by to a growing one and not in war yet for long, it will just get eaten later by suprise attack from the big nation, while it could be with the others to stop that growth(it can work, maybe giving more time, and expanding nations are necessarily into other wars already). So, it's still possible to produce wars with the Alliances that will bring you advantage in your conquest quest. But it's basically that since there is no more options.
Expanding (big) nations are the ones getting powerfull and taking on high ranking positions. The more splited nations still at the rest of the map or fighting between, the better.
Mephistopheles
29 Jan 2009, 12:21
Something that I particularly enjoy doing is the following:
If I have an old trade agreement with a smaller country that I want to conquer I'm faced with the problem that breaking the treaty will cause me a penalty on kingdom power, which can be costly. Also, other kingdoms tend to frown upon such behaviour, which can worsen bad relations even further.
In order to avoid this I extend the trade agreement to an alliance, which usually comes easy if you're the bigger party. Afterwards ask your tiny ally to engage in war with your biggest enemy in the vicinity.
Chances are the ally will be annihilated quickly. Afterwards push forward your campaign against that enemy that conquered the former ally and take the raided provinces in a swift motion.
There are endless options in this scenario like marrying a prince to the tiny ally so when the king dies in combat your family will inherit the provinces, or sending a spy there to achieve the same thing without entering royal marriage, or supporting rebels in the provinces later on so new kingdoms emerge that you can declare war upon without any penalty, ... - just be creative and adjust to the situation.